Wednesday, 21 October 2009

The delusional image - I don't geddit?

I'm going to need some help on getting my head around this one folks.

I'm in the process of enquiring about someone who's been on the card for years. More to come on that after we make some progress!

This got me thinking - If this doesn't workout, where do I go from here?

How do girls pick guys?

Let me break it down a little. When you first see a girl you see how she's dressed. If she wears hijaab/jilbaab you get that insta-win feeling. If you find her mutually attractive. Another point. Based on these 2 preferences this is how most guys decide to go forward and enquire about them.

How else are we supposed to pick them? We go for the two factors most apparent to us when pursuing a wife.

Now how does this work for a girls picking a guy? Must he wear a jubba and have a beard the size of a fist? Well that's me off the cards.

I've noticed a common trend as of recent. I get a lot Asian girls making eye contact with me. Ya know . . the type to flirt/pick someone up. I feel embarrassed/shy, I can't maintain eye contact. No, I haven't got a chip on my shoulder and I don't think I'm 'it'. I'm just not what you perceive me to be. 

I'm not hanging up my gloves yet, I just feel that if this falls prematurely (looking likely). I'll lose motivation for a while.

It's a sad lonely battle. What are us guys supposed to do?


  1. lol i always look at the beard and the masjid factor and the lower the gaze factor. those three are something that i look for being external to the situation and to the life of the brother. but thats just me

  2. I can answer this questions pretty detailed. I'm not sure if this taps into the "lower your gaze" rule, but I look at the whole face. Basically what I'm looking for is a beard (with no particular length..hopefully not too long) and whether its properly trimmed or not (I'll tell you, some brothers grow beards that are all over the place - not attractive).

    I like to also watch how the brother in question deals with the he Mr. Friendly? Laughing and joking with every sister? Or is he more of the "Answer the question professionally" kind of brother?

    If he passes those tests and I feel that there might possibly be a chance, I have brothers who are "like brothers" in that they are either way too young or already taken and MUCH older than me that I would ask to get more information. (Note: I haven't been bold enough to take that step just yet...)

    As for being rejected for your location...I'm not sure I understand. Are you referring to your geographic location?

  3. Rejected based on your location? Please clarify, because really, you have people marrying from across the Pacific, Atlantic etc (e.g. UK and US). So if you are rejected, it may not be soley because of your location. And it will definitely not be because of you.

    As for 'criteria'. Well, it depends on each individual. Each female will have her different 'criteria', so it's hard to generalize.

    I personally would first look at the person's character. You can't read to develop akhlaq. (and yes, of course religion is important.)

    To me, the size of the beard, or whether the person has a beard or not, is not the issue. Beard is sunnah, yes, but the person can eventually grow the beard if he wants to. But they can't just 'grow' in their akhlaq within 2 weeks, you know what I mean?

    A person can have a beard, go to the masjid every day, but still have an unbearable character.

    Anyway, other things on the list -->

    intelligence, maturity, commitment, responsibility, looks (but remember, beauty is in the eyes of the beholder), family background (note, this does not mean he has to be from a wealthy family, but a stable one), financial means (note again, this does not mean we are looking for a trillionaire, but ability to support the family within reason).

    Does it seem like a long 'list'? Well, perhaps. But we know that no one is perfect , because we ourselves are not perfect either.

    Hope that helps!

    Don't give up hope! When things haven't happened yet, don't imagine that they have.

    And if things really don't work out, it's all for the best.... I know it hurts, it pains. But trust me, Allah will inshaAllah give you something better (in a sense that it is more suitable to you).

    InshaAllah khayr!

  4. I agree with Anon in regards to first trying to figure out the character first. The outward appearance is not something I base my decision on. Although huge unkept beards usually scare me.

    I've seen attractive guys who may not be good Muslims (as in they do not keep halal or do not pray) so I reject them on that basis. Or I see a guy who prays, fasts, but there is no attraction. But if the guy truly seems good, I try moving forward in conversation to get some additional details about his thoughts, his religious views to see how he communicates and if attraction builds in that way because of his character.

    If it makes you feel any better, I've been rejected (without a conversation) based on my geographic location as well. Actually for some reason I don't mind it too much because whatever happens is for the best so I just have faith in Allah (swt) that if it were meant to be, it would happen. :)

  5. Too much talk from sisters about complicated, inherently Western notions of what compatibility really is.

    All those things really sound nice, but how do you possibly think some of those things can be determined before marriage? In reality, it's just a hunch based on visual and anecdotal evidence (what you see + what you're told).

    Keeping things simple would do everyone good.

    0. Attractive? (as human nature, I put it at 0)
    1. Muslim?
    2. Sunni?
    3. Prays regularly?
    4. Hijab/beard?
    5. Job/family plan?

    Result? Pass or Fail.

    That could work, right?

  6. our criterias here were from an external point of view. you dont know the person. before you consider someone, you first see his outward appearance. if that is correct with you, you go further to know his character. and the second step determines wether you will marry him or not. Allah's willing. noone said the physical appearance was the decisive point. but it matters. i know many who has these 5 things you listed. but they dont matter. because you have to go in depth of those 5 things. ok hes sunni, but what does he practice? what does sunni entail? he prays regularly ok. but does he pray on time? like he should. and the story is continued lol

  7. I'm with habibti. If there is no initial attraction, then what exactly is persuading me to pursue finding out more about a brother? Unless of course, he inquires first, in which case, I feel sisters are for more open-minded in getting to know a brother better for the sake of marriage despite if there is not initial attraction so to speak.

    Apearance is not're right. Any man can grow a beard and any woman can wear a piece of cloth on her the end of the day its their adab and akhlaq that counts. And that...i feel is determined through extensive background checks :D.

  8. Mr. Quest! Things are looking lovely my friend and going uphill inshaAllah. This was a great read: I like the guy who broke it down ready for you: just look for the things on the list and it's a pass/fail - :-) that ought to do it.

    emm, I might sound like a geek on crack when I say this, but when i'm in a crowd, especially if a crowd with muslim men, i hardly ever scan them down for 'a possible match' type thing. Even when suitors come along or whatever.

    I'm usually the one checking out the food table or the kids corner for 'more eventful things' if it's a conference especially (wink wink). And maybe that's why I'm still single so scratch that off your advice list.

    emm... here's a tip: just tell the girl who might reject you for your location that you've woken up one morning and discovered this hidden love for traveling.

    Good luck Mr. Quest!

  9. In regards to the location issue. Yes, her family lives approx 100 miles away (she studies in same city) hardly far. We haven't initially met. A sister is finding out on my behalf. I will soon post, once I have some tangible results.

    @Habibiti - Fair point and I agree. However finding out if someone prays on time, (haha) how do you go about determining that? Hehe :)

    @Hijaabified - Jazakallah Khair for the insightful post. Yes, I do too look at the face (for the intent of marriage). Agreed with the beard issue. Having a messy beard is just not presentable.

    @Anon - I'm with you on this one. Thanks, sometimes we get lost and disheartened in these issues and we forget these setbacks are all an excuse for fate.

    @Nomad - Raised a grin :). For me I do a similar check list but after the initial criteria . . it's finding out about the persons characteristics for compatibility.

    @Lady Quest - Talk about tying the wrong end of the camel :P. I did mention that I intend to travel and do lots of it. As I mentioned above, will go into it once I have something more concrete inshallah.

  10. no you cannot know firsthand if he prays on time, you have to investigate of course, ask around you ( in a subtle manner)

  11. Salam. I would like to make a comment to you, and I'm saying this because I think you are *very* misguided. In your posts, including the twins and the girl you are currently interested in, you seem to approach women because of their looks. You know, the prophet (pbuh) said very specifically not to choose a woman because of her beauty. I also find it *extremely* ironic that the only reason you didn't approach this woman before was because she showed her neck. You therefore judged her sense of modesty- you seem to think that now that her neck is covered, she's a good Muslim in your eyes, but before, she was lacking too much to be considered. That's a very strange conception. Brother, I am sorry for the woman you marry because if you marry based on superficial things, then she is in for a hard life 30 years from now when her beauty is gone. Also, do not make judgements like a hijabi is a better Muslim than a woman who doesn't cover her hair-- most women who cover do it because it is cultural, or because it is expected of them, or indeed, because it attracts men like you. Very few women cover because they sincerely want to be close to Allah. Indeed, it's disgusting that the hijab actually attracts men in this way. As a hijabi myself, let me tell you that I am very disturbed at the way men see the hijab as a marriage invitation. So how should you look for a woman? Don't based on externl things. Do as the prophet (pbuh) advised, and marry based on iman. Is there a woman who volunteers to help the poor in the community, a woman who is studying to become a doctor so she can help people, a woman who is kind to everyone she meets? This is the woman you should look for.

  12. Muslima - To the right side of the blog you'll see a heading called "Contributors". You'll then realise there are two contributors. Two different people. Two different posts.

    Have you not been reading? If you pay attention to detail you may begin to realise the point I've been getting across is that I don't wish to choose a women purely based on her looks.

    The premise of your argument is based on that. It defeats your whole post.

    I fail to see where I've pointed out that a hiajbi is better than a non-hijaabi. Why? Allah(swt) is the best of judges. It is not any persons place to judge an individuals sincerity based on a piece of cloth.

    You've completely swayed your argument on the other end of the spectrum. A Hijab is not an invitation to marriage. It's something which is obliviously apparent to someone who is seeking. Note the difference.

    The purpose of the post was to create a discussion. A discussion to see the consensus out there on said topic.

  13. Muslima -
    I think that you made a good point, but also, in my opinion, it doesn't seem to me that the author is looking at superficial things like you say. It seems to me that the author is looking for deeper things, like iman, true modesty, and character. But he is looking at the superficial things, like whether or not she wears hijab, because he believes that it signifies something deeper, like modesty and character. He is assuming (correctly or incorrectly), as sometimes I do as well, that a woman who covers properly has a greater chance of being a better muslim than someone who doesn't. Of course, you are correct, many only wear it for cultural or sometimes for fashion reasons, but that is the assumption i think the author is working off of. He is not able to hang out with these girls, since that is not Islamic, to determine which ones have good character and are modest, so he is doing the best he can based on limited information and probabilities. That is my opinion of the situation. That is how I look at things, too, often. I know that probably the author and I probably have made assumptions about people which are incorrect, based on these superficial things, but it is really hard to really find out about her character and morality, since we can't just freely mix with those of the opposite gender.
    Just my opinion, no disrespect intended.

  14. i never thought a guy has this kind of issue when chosing a bride :)

  15. salam,
    I never thought of anything like this before! I usually thought that guys looked for the modest/intelligent/respectful type of girl. It's true that you can't tell the character of someone based on their hijab. But judging as a hijabi I think that if you are going after a girl with a hijab then you should take in how she wears the hijab. If she wears it with skinny jeans and her neck showing then it shows how much respect she has for it. But if she wears it modestly than it shows that she sees it as more than a piece of cloth.

    I do have a question though. I have no intention of marrying inside my culture(somali) but I don't think that anyone outside of somali would be willing to consider someone from outside their culture. So if you were approached by a somali girl then would you consider her? Just a question-not to put you on the spot :P